Nirodbaran

Talks with Sri Aurobindo

Volume 1

10 December 1938 – 14 January 1941

3 February 1940

Purani: Many people are coming from Bengal for the darshan and many Zamindars too.

Nirodbaran: Zamindars? Only in name, perhaps.

Sri Aurobindo: Kiran S. Roy is coming. Suren Ghose seems to be arranging for seven persons to accompany him. I don’t know how many will actually come.

Nirodbaran: I am glad that Bengal is turning now to Sri Aurobindo.

Purani: How do you mean? You can say the “non-public” is coming now.

Nirodbaran: Charupada and Sotuda will be very glad.

Sri Aurobindo: Why?

Nirodbaran: Because they were worrying about what would happen to Bengal after this Muslim Raj.

Sri Aurobindo: What will happen to Bengal depends on Charupada and Sotuda.

Nirodbaran: Anyhow, it is the effect of the Muslim Raj.

Purani: It seems Huq is trying to come to an agreement with the Bengal Hindu leaders.

Sri Aurobindo: He is not out to get Muslim Raj?

Purani: He may have realised that it wouldn’t do. It seems that among the Muslims there is a Socialist party which says that the problem is not at all religious but economic.

Sri Aurobindo: One can look at any question as one likes. (Laughter).

Purani: Professor Kabir and others are for an agreement with the Hindus. The Viceroy is seeing Jinnah on the 6th. It is not known whether the Viceroy has called him or Jinnah himself has asked to see him.

Sri Aurobindo: The Viceroy must have called him.

Purani: It would be better if Sikandar Hyat Khan were to be with him.

Sri Aurobindo: The Viceroy has already seen him. The Viceroy has some plan perhaps. He may be coming to a compromise with Gandhi and wants to warn Jinnah or tell him to square up.

Satyendra: It is strange that Jinnah has never said what he wants.

Sri Aurobindo: Perhaps he doesn’t know it himself – unless he wants to be a Minister.

Nirodbaran: And that he can’t say publicly.

Sri Aurobindo: But it is clear what he wants. He wants either a Muslim half of India over which he can rule or some arrangement by which he can rule at Delhi. In that way Sikandar is clever. His scheme looks democratic and at the same time will satisfy what he wants.

Purani: Sir Raja Ali is angry with Gandhi because Gandhi says most of the Muslims were originally Hindus. Raja Ali says it is insulting.

Sri Aurobindo (laughing): But it is true. Most of the Muslims were Hindus.

Purani: Raja Ali says the Muslims are democratic.

Sri Aurobindo: That is a different story. It does not exclude the fact that they were Hindus.

Purani: No. From Shah Jehan onwards a new relationship began between Muslims and Hindus.

Sri Aurobindo: Yes. Dara, Shah Jehan’s son, was almost a Hindu.

Purani: One Dr. Kantilal has asked what one should do, and how to become fit in order to come here.

Sri Aurobindo: He can do anything that would make him fit. (Laughter)

Purani: No, he wants some guidance or direction.

Sri Aurobindo: That is another matter. He wanted to “become” something. If he wants guidance, then consecration and quietude of mind.

Purani: I shall write that to him.

Satyendra: I know him intimately. He came here once. He wanted advice from me, but as I kept silent he wrote to Purani. He has been in contact with many Yogis but remains unsatisfied. He has read the Arya too.

Champaklal: Pujalal was saying that Parvati, worshipping the sun by gazing at it, obtained Shiva. How is it she didn’t go blind by gazing at the sun?

Sri Aurobindo: Why should she go blind?

Champaklal: We have a saying that by gazing at the sun one goes blind.

Purani: Because of its strong rays, especially at midday.

Sri Aurobindo: If you start by gazing at midday you will go blind.

Champaklal: Is that a symbolic sun at which one has to gaze?

Sri Aurobindo: No; one can gaze at the physical sun by practising gradually, little by little. I asked R to practise. He said, “Oh, I will go blind!” But I didn’t go blind.

Champaklal: You also practised it?

Sri Aurobindo: Yes. Of course everyone can’t do it.

Purani: One has to start with the morning sun. I could gaze for about three hours.

Evening

Champaklal: Pujalal was asking if the light of the sun can help one spiritually.

Sri Aurobindo: Spiritually? It can help indirectly.

Champaklal: He was also asking what effect the practice of eating leaves, fasting, etc., can have.

Sri Aurobindo: They help one to get mastery over the body and will.

Champaklal: And does the light of the sun also help physically?

Sri Aurobindo: That is Agarwal’s department. (Laughter) It is a yogic practice. Of course, it does not give you the knowledge of the Brahman but it helps indirectly, as I said, by preparing you for it.

Purani: An advocate from Calcutta was angry with Nolini because he wasn’t given a room to stay in the Ashram.

Sri Aurobindo: Did he think it was a free hotel?

Purani: Afterwards Y met him and explained to him that this Ashram is not like others. So he had no reason to be angry with Nolini. Y was on the point of becoming angry with the advocate because he flared up against Nolini.

Purani read out a fine joke from the Indian Express which Sri Aurobindo enjoyed very much.

Sri Aurobindo (replying in the same vein): You saw the article about Hitler’s secret weapon? Somebody writes that Hitler will drop gas bombs on England and people will fall asleep for a fortnight. When they wake up they will find themselves already invaded by Germany! (Laughter)

Purani: And the German invaders won’t fall asleep by the effect of the gas?

Satyendra: The descent of Supermind will be like that. Nirodbaran will fall asleep and on waking up he will see that it has descended.

Nirodbaran: And that Satyendra is supramentalised!

Sri Aurobindo: Or it may be like the case of Haranath.

Satyendra: That was really remarkable. The colour of Haranath’s skin changed during a serious illness when he was lying unconscious; his companions thought he was dead and started arranging for his funeral.