Nirodbaran

Talks with Sri Aurobindo

Volume 1

10 December 1938 – 14 January 1941

1 March 1940

Nirodbaran was twisting a letter in his hands. Sri Aurobindo, hearing the faint noise, looked back.

Sri Aurobindo: What’s that?

Nirodbaran: Z’s letter. He wants guidance.

Purani: Any more of Dutt’s stories?

Nirodbaran: No more. He has stopped.

Sri Aurobindo: His story of my meeting him at Baroda Station may be true, as I used to go very often to the Station. And about his earthen tumbler incident, there may be some foundation to it, but I object to the shooting incident. Ask him the names of those two Marathi youths. There was no one I knew who was quite capable of doing such things, going to the Consuls, the Czar, the Kaiser.

Purani: Does Barin’s article show any change in his attitude?

Sri Aurobindo (smiling, stretching out both hands in a half-hanging position and then pausing a little): It is difficult to say about Barin. After having failed in whatever he tried, he may look back now in a different light. He says whatever suits him at the moment. There may be some change in his attitude, but how far he has made inner progress is difficult to say.

Purani: A change in attitude doesn’t indicate inner progress?

Sri Aurobindo: Not always, because it may be simply a mental change and it may be due to his having failed in everything after going from here, while the Ashram has grown ever since. That may have impressed him.

Purani: To realise and say that he has deviated from the path is rather strong for Barin, I thought.

Sri Aurobindo: He says whatever is uppermost in his mind, according to his moods, and he says it with force.

Nirodbaran: X is trying to boycott the Calcutta Nationalist papers, especially the Jugantar.

Sri Aurobindo: Why?

Nirodbaran: It seems that this paper criticised X and supported the Working Committee. The editor of the Hindustan Standard has been dismissed through his influence.

Sri Aurobindo: What for?

Nirodbaran: Because the editor made a joint declaration with other editors against X’s move to muzzle the press. It is a Leftist paper.

Sri Aurobindo: Is that the only Leftist paper?

Nirodbaran: I think so.

Sri Aurobindo: Doesn’t X talk of democracy and its rights?

Nirodbaran: Yes, when he is flung down, I suppose. Y seems to have said that fair and just criticism is welcome even of people serving the country.

Sri Aurobindo: But anybody can say he is serving the country and then do whatever he likes.

Purani: X is serving more his personal ambition, I should say.

Nirodbaran: Fazlul Huque gave the same argument when he restricted the Hindustan Standard, saying that fair and just criticism is always welcome but when it brings in the name of Allah, then …

Sri Aurobindo: Allah?

Nirodbaran: Yes, attacking Allah. I believe he means religion. X says that the public have every right to boycott a paper if they find it is going against the national interest.

Sri Aurobindo: The public also have the right to buy any paper they like or to boycott it, but why should anybody advise or dictate to them? The public are not fools.

Nirodbaran: That is exactly what the Patrika says. It declares that the Bengal public are not fools. Let them decide as they wish. Why should X hold meetings from park to park to boycott a particular paper?

Satyendra: He is holding an anti-compromise conference.

Sri Aurobindo: But who is going in for a compromise?

Satyendra: It is the impression both of the Leftists and of X that Gandhi will compromise. Gandhi said, “I am not against compromise if that is for the good of the national interest. Satyagraha doesn’t preclude compromise.” But Gandhi won’t betray the country – that is quite certain. Everybody is attacking the Congress: X, the Muslims, the Justice Party.

Nirodbaran: M.N. Roy too.

Sri Aurobindo: And X is attacking M.N. Roy. Such is the universal movement. Look at Europe.

Satyendra: Ours is a reflection of that, perhaps.

Nirodbaran: X says he was an idealist; how was he a political leader?

Sri Aurobindo: That sort of leadership is nothing. He was just beginning his career. If you have the gift of the gab, the power of ideas and the ability to put them into form, you can always be a leader. All politics is a show. In the British Parliament it is the Civil Service people who are really behind everything and these people whose names are never known do the real work. The Ministers are only their mouthpieces, except for a few rare cases like Churchill and Hore-Belisha. The Civil Servants have been at their job for their lifetime and they know everything about it.

The Mother’s brother, for instance, organised Congoland in Africa and did a lot of work. He was one of the best colonial governors and administrators – but all the credit went to the Minister who was only a figurehead at the top. Even when he was an officer in Equatorial Africa, sometimes as Governor and sometimes as Governor-General, the whole job was done by him. He hardly had a bed but used to lie down in an easy-chair. He is nearly seventy now but as soon as the war broke out he went to the office and asked for work. Now he is working eighteen hours a day.

Evening

Krishnalal had done a painting of a buffalo. The Mother had been overheard remarking to Sri Aurobindo that it looked a bit sentimental.

Sri Aurobindo (from his bed, to Purani): I have been looking at the buffalo. It looks as if it were undergoing a psychic change. (To Satyendra) What is your opinion?

Satyendra: I don’t know, Sir. I don’t know what the idea behind it is. It doesn’t appeal to me. The white elephant plucking lotuses from a pond was all right. The elephant is said to be Durga’s vehicle. But why the buffalo?

Sri Aurobindo: The buffalo is also the vehicle of someone.

Purani: Of Yamaraj.

At this point the Mother came in.

Satyendra (to the Mother): We have been wondering what the meaning of this buffalo could be.

The Mother: Meaning? Did Krishnalal want to give it any meaning? I thought it was only a buffalo, like his cats. One year we had flowers, last year birds and this year beasts.

Satyendra narrated some Gujarati stories about buffaloes.

Sri Aurobindo (to Nirodbaran): Sarat Chatterji also has written a story, hasn’t he?

Nirodbaran: I think it was about a bullock.

Satyendra: It is supposed that while cow’s milk is good, buffalo’s milk makes the brain dull. Doctors don’t prescribe it. Why don’t you take milk, Sir?

Sri Aurobindo: Because I don’t care to.

Satyendra: It is very good for the blood.

Sri Aurobindo: I have plenty of blood, I think.

Dr. Becharlal: Milk is said to be good for spirituality.

Sri Aurobindo: It is no better than Nirod’s brinjal. (Laughter) The Mother and I don’t take milk. There are many people who have taken milk for many years – even ten years – but I don’t know that they have progressed spiritually. Punnuswamy, who was suffering from an ulcer, took nothing but milk.

Dr. Becharlal: Milk is believed to be an ideal food.

Sri Aurobindo: I have no idea.

Nirodbaran: Dr. Becharlal is rather fond of milk.

Satyendra: I also don’t disfavour it.

Sri Aurobindo: But that is for the sake of your blood. (Laughter)

Satyendra: There are stories of buffaloes being used as sacrifice.

Sri Aurobindo: Ah, then this buffalo must be one which is to be so used!

Nirodbaran: Nishikanto is having his old trouble – pain, vomiting, etc.

Sri Aurobindo: Has he been eating anything?

Nirodbaran: I don’t think so. No resources.

Sri Aurobindo: No resources?

Nirodbaran: No pocket money, but he took some sweets which people had brought during the Darshan period.

Sri Aurobindo: Ah, I thought so.

Nirodbaran: But they were nothing much …

Sri Aurobindo: Nothing much?

Nirodbaran: I mean, not so much in quantity – about three or four, he said.

Sri Aurobindo: How was he cured last time?

Nirodbaran: By your Force, he says.

Sri Aurobindo: And now he is brought back to his old condition by his own force?

Nirodbaran: It seems Dutt’s story about Prafulla Chakravarty’s death is not all correct. Nolini himself was one of the party. They never approached Dutt. But the boy’s death by a bomb explosion is quite true.

Purani: Nolini said that Barin was carrying the bomb in his hand with the cap on.

Sri Aurobindo: Cap on? Just like Barin.

Purani: And when Prafulla threw the bomb, it exploded in the air before touching the ground.

Nirodbaran: Chakravarty thought that as soon as it would touch the ground he would hide himself behind a rock. He didn’t expect it would explode before.

Sri Aurobindo: Even so, it was very risky to watch like that. I think it was Nevinson who said that the Indian revolutionaries were as good as the Russian. But this incident is hardly an encouraging one. Time is needed to become efficient. It took the Russians more than a hundred years to throw off the Czar. Among the Indian revolutionaries Rashbehari Bose was an exceptional man – very clever in every way. Pulin Das was also very good.

Purani: Rashbehari was really remarkable. He was a linguist. He used to speak Punjabi just like a Punjabi. He escaped just the night before the arrests. All the others got arrested.