Nirodbaran
Talks with Sri Aurobindo
Volume 1
10 December 1938 – 14 January 1941
20 May 1940
Purani: Hitler’s declaration that before August 15 the war has to be finished and peace agreed upon seems significant.
Sri Aurobindo: That is the sign that he is the enemy of our work. And from the values concerned in the conflict it should be quite clear that what is behind him is the Asuric, the Titanic power.
Purani: It is strange how he takes his decisions.
Sri Aurobindo: It is not he who takes the decisions. The Being behind him decides.
Purani: It knows perhaps that, August 15 being your birthday, there is going to be some descent of the Divine on that date.
Sri Aurobindo: I don’t think it believes in any such descent. It would say, “I must make some decisive movement before anything decisive happens on that date.” This Being comes here from time to time and sees what kind of work is going on.
Nirodbaran: It doesn’t believe in any descent of the Divine?
Sri Aurobindo: It believes in its own descent and is too self-confident about it.
Nirodbaran: But surely it knows that the work here is against its own interests?
Sri Aurobindo (laughing): Of course.
Purani: Is it only one Being or a troop?
Sri Aurobindo: There are more than one, but this is a very powerful Being. Have you read Paul Richard’s Lord of the Nations?
Purani: No.
Sri Aurobindo: I believe it was not published. He was in communion with this Being and the plans and methods he has written of in the book are the same as those carried out now. He said there that the present civilisation was to be destroyed, but really it is the destruction of the whole human civilisation that is aimed at, and already in Germany Hitler has done it: there is no civilisation left there. What reigns there is barbarism supported by science – science meaning physical science. And Hitler has destroyed human civilisation wherever he has gone – as in Poland.
Purani: Christianity and all religion seem to be his targets.
Sri Aurobindo: Yes. What he may want is Ludendorf’s religion – the Norse religion of a primitive type where primitive instincts are worshipped.
Purani: Do these Beings recognise that there are higher divine powers?
Sri Aurobindo: It depends on the type of Being. For example, some know that there are Gods but they won’t admit that they are greater than themselves.
Purani: The fight between the Devas and the Asuras is graphically described in the Puranas. Just as the Asuras are against the human race, there must be other Beings who help the human race.
Sri Aurobindo: Yes. Human beings by themselves are no match for the Asuras. If it is only an influence from the Asuras or other Beings, the result may depend on that influence. Here in Hitler’s case it is not merely an influence but a possession, even perhaps an incarnation. The case of Stalin is similar. The vital world has descended upon the physical. That is why the intellectuals are perplexed at the destruction of their civilisation, of all the values they had made and stood for. They deny the existence of the worlds beyond the physical and so they are bound to be perplexed.
France is calling back her past to defend her present. Weygand and Pétain have been called, haven’t they?
Purani: Yes. It seems there are other military geniuses who are not getting an opportunity because of a religious bar or some such factor.
Sri Aurobindo: Religious bar?
Purani: They may happen to be Roman Catholics.
Sri Aurobindo: But Weygand and Pétain are Catholics. Foch was an ardent Catholic. Nevinson, during the last war, wrote strongly against a general who was a freethinker and who had made a mess. If there were any genius about today, Weygand should know.
Satyendra: The Germans have made a great advance in the last twenty-four hours.
Sri Aurobindo: Yes, a rapid advance.
Purani: They have brought in a new kind of armoured tank which seems very formidable.
Sri Aurobindo: The French anti-tank guns were not effective. So now they have brought up heavy seventy-five millimetre guns. It is because of these tanks that the French were thrown off balance. Naturally, if thousands of tanks push forward, the infantry can’t do anything unless they are supported by strong mechanical weapons. The British Army seems to rely on their air force, but the air force can’t decide a war. It can only harass the enemy. The Mother says that the R.A.F. bombers can only act at night while the German bombers operate only during the day.