Nirodbaran
Talks with Sri Aurobindo
Volume 1
10 December 1938 – 14 January 1941
16 June 1940
Purani: It was Tagore and not Sailen Ghose who appealed to Roosevelt yesterday. (Laughter) I don’t know how Suvrata could confuse your name and Tagore’s.
Sri Aurobindo (laughing): Perhaps because my name also has bin as in Rabindranath and the second syllable of Tagore has a similar sound to Ghose. (Laughter)
Nirodbaran: Dilip says that the Americans won’t come into the war; he is quite definite about it.
Sri Aurobindo: They are hesitating and they may not unless they are frightened of conquest by Hitler.
Purani: Americans are now willing to enlist for the Allies but their law doesn’t allow them.
Nirodbaran: Can’t the law be changed?
Sri Aurobindo: It can be but the Congress has to do it. It is not sufficiently war-minded, perhaps.
Nirodbaran: Dilip says, “If the Americans don’t come now, why should they come later to board a sinking ship?”
Sri Aurobindo: Quite so.
Nirodbaran: I lay a bet that America will come. But the point is, if she comes too late it won’t be very effective, specially if France is already overrun.
Sri Aurobindo: Exactly.
Nirodbaran: He says that the Americans haven’t much sympathy for Paris, but they have for London. If London falls then they may come, for after all they belong to the same stock.
Sri Aurobindo: That is not true. They have more sympathy for Paris than for London. As a matter of fact they don’t trust Englishmen.
Purani: So many Americans visit Paris all round the year!
Nirodbaran: Somebody told Dilip that now that the Germans are pushing southwards and to the rear of the Maginot Line, the French run the risk of being annihilated.
Sri Aurobindo: Annihilated? How? They can withdraw towards the south. They still have their fleet.
Nirodbaran: They can go to Africa and fight from there, as they say.
Sri Aurobindo: If they can defend the Maginot Line and provided they have the supplies and the ammunition, they can stand for a long time.
Nirodbaran: But does it operate both ways?
Purani: Yes, that is the arrangement.
Sri Aurobindo: The French made the mistake of not concentrating all their troops against Hitler.
Nirodbaran: Dilip says if America is attacked by Hitler, it will only be after a long time.
Sri Aurobindo: Yes, he will settle first with Asia and Africa.
Nirodbaran: England?
Sri Aurobindo: An attack on England is not likely unless her navy is first destroyed.
Nirodbaran: England won’t give the fight up even if France is conquered.
Sri Aurobindo: No; so long as she has her fleet, she will carry on.
Nirodbaran: And Russia is there.
Sri Aurobindo: Yes, Hitler is the great danger to Russia.
Nirodbaran: Stalin is already taking measures to protect himself in the Baltic.
Sri Aurobindo (Addressing Purani): Yes, what is this pact of non-aggression with Lithuania that Russia speaks of? Non-aggression against whom? Sending troops can only mean landing in Germany.
Purani: Yes, there was some non-aggression pact. Of course these are all excuses.
Sri Aurobindo: Stalin wants to fortify his position while Hitler is engaged elsewhere. He is fortifying it in Galicia too.
Satyendra: These governments are all a nuisance. Perhaps what Sisir said may come true that we may have to seek refuge on some islets. (Laughter)
Sri Aurobindo: Yes, if islets are available. (Laughter) We shall have to if Hitler or Stalin comes in. Stalin will at the very outset liquidate – this is the Russian term – all Sannyasins and religious institutions. As for Hitler, he will ask us to accept him as the head; and factories and industries will be run by the Germans. There will be thorough Nazism. Doraiswamy will have a hard time. As for Y, he will be beaten to death. (Laughter)
Purani: Astrologers say that after the 20th of this month Hitler’s decline will begin.
Sri Aurobindo: Which astrologers?
Purani: The Parsi one and somebody else also. Pavitra too knows astrology, but he did not try to see Hitler’s horoscope.
Sri Aurobindo: He is not good at events. He studies the character, and there he has made remarkable readings. About Hitler he has found that he will cause terrible bloodshed and that he runs a great danger to his own life.
Nirodbaran: Amery has repeated the old formula about India’s internal differences.
Sri Aurobindo: Yes, these Labour leaders seem to be useless as regards India. In their own affairs they can exert pressure on the Government. Even the Manchester Guardian defends Jinnah. It doesn’t know enough about India, it seems.
Nirodbaran: That paper sometimes takes this side and sometimes that side.
Sri Aurobindo: If the Congress had agreed to the scheme of a few people coming together for discussions, then they could have tried for a compromise. The English people are a practical people.
They don’t understand the principles the Congress stands for. And for them to agree to whatever the Constituent Assembly decides is out of the question. Stafford Cripps may do that but he is not the Premier.
About Lady Hydari who died one or two days ago, Sri Aurobindo said that she would not have lasted long, but her death was hastened. Doctors said that she should have lived eighteen months more. She was much better here. In order to live longer she would have had to make an inner effort. She was open to various influences, even to those who are hostile towards the Ashram.
Evening
Sri Aurobindo: Fazlul Huque has come down again on Bose’s paper by demanding more security. By the way, this agitation against the Holwell monument seems to be a pre-arranged affair. The Forward says that Fazlul Huque has already said that it will be removed.
Nirodbaran: Yes, there was an attempt on the part of the Muslims to remove the monument and Bose has taken up that cry. In the Corporation, a European member proposed to withdraw all advertisements from the Star of India because of its attack on Sri Krishna, and the Hindu Sabha supported him. But Bose opposed it. His party, himself and other Muslims voted against it.
Sri Aurobindo (laughing): You mean he is also a Muslim? (Laughter)
Nirodbaran: Going to be!
Purani: The Germans claim to have taken Verdun which means they have crossed the Maginot Line.
Sri Aurobindo: The Mother says that the Maginot Line is a farce because from the point where the Rhine divides France and Germany, there is no proper Maginot, only scattered fortifications. Only in the north from Montmedy the Maginot proper begins. I don’t know why they have done that. Have they thought that the Rhine will be a natural barrier? It is absurd. If such is the case they ought to remove their troops from there in time.