Nirodbaran
Talks with Sri Aurobindo
Volume 1
10 December 1938 – 14 January 1941
2 July 1940
Sri Aurobindo (looking at Purani): We are in a queer position about money.
Purani: How?
Sri Aurobindo: The British Government has stopped the British notes from coming here and the French notes are not accepted by this Government.
Purani: Why have they done that?
Sri Aurobindo: Don’t know. The Consul seems to have written to the Government to make an exception for Pondy, but no reply has come as yet. Swiss money also is not accepted. Jwalanti says that she is ruined. All her money is in Switzerland.
Purani: Perhaps because people here are converting all their money into British money. M has been doing that for the last six months. The Chamber of Commerce also saw the Governor about these banks refusing to accept French money.
Sri Aurobindo: That is about the Bank of France. Naturally the banks here can’t accept French money because the value of the franc has fallen.
Purani: It is similar to the last war. The mark had fallen so low that people began to buy it in large numbers. Perhaps Germany may introduce the mark now in France.
Sri Aurobindo: Amrita went to see some businessman here and during the talk the businessman said, “Oh, I am ruined!”
Purani: Oh yes, plenty of people will have the same fate.
Satyendra: In the market there is panic.
Sri Aurobindo: Panic? People are desperate.
Nirodbaran: Is it all caused by the Indian Government?
Sri Aurobindo: No. The Indian Government has no jurisdiction over the colonies. Must be the British Government.
Nirodbaran: Is it done to exert pressure on the colonies?
Sri Aurobindo: No, in that case it would also have operated in Africa and Madagascar. They have nothing to do with British money.
Purani: Gabriel says that he approached the French Government through the Governor to allow his wife to come here, and the reply was that the wives of the functionaries would not be allowed to leave France.
Sri Aurobindo: Then others’ wives can? (Laughter) No, nobody is allowed to leave France now.
Purani: Perhaps they fear that the internal condition of France will be revealed by these people. But the tourists will be doing that. Have you seen De Gaulle’s statement about the French Army? He says that France has been defeated without any fight. Only sixty thousand people have been killed and nearly a million imprisoned – where was the fight? This is most absurd! One million imprisoned!
Sri Aurobindo: Worse than the fall of the Third Empire. There was mismanagement at that time. But they fought before they lost.
Purani: What Dr. André says may be partly true, that the French Army didn’t really fight. Otherwise it couldn’t have collapsed like that. The French air force perhaps didn’t fly over Germany at all and so dropped no bombs, saying, “Who is going to risk being killed?”
Sri Aurobindo: We didn’t hear much of the French air force, except at the beginning and that was only in the rear of the French line.
Purani: De Gaulle’s accusation may be true. All these huge fortifications of the Maginot Line built at such a cost have come to nothing.
Sri Aurobindo: He has the right to speak. He was the one man who was in favour of mobile warfare and urged having tanks and mechanised units. He became so troublesome that they had to remove him. Reynaud made him the Chief of Staff and from him he must have gathered all this news.
Satyendra: He has now been degraded and has retired.
Sri Aurobindo: Yes, he speaks now in his own right and appoints vice-admirals.
Satyendra: The colonies are still undecided. They don’t seem to have made up their minds.
Sri Aurobindo: No, except the Jibouti Governor who has said clearly that he won’t surrender. Others are still hesitating. After tomorrow it will be seen what happens. Tomorrow the tenth day of the armistice will expire and five more days will remain for the African and Mediterranean coasts.
Satyendra: They are hoping Micawber-like that something will turn up.
Sri Aurobindo: Yes, waiting for that and to see who does what.
Purani: Russia has already come into the Balkans.
Sri Aurobindo: No, not quite. Still in central Europe. Her claims on Hungary are understandable. It will be the completion of her Polish campaign. But she has no claim on Bulgarian ports in the Black Sea. It has to be seen now what attitude they take.
Purani: If something happens in the Balkans it will be interesting.
Sri Aurobindo: Yes, that is the only way to save the situation. Hungary and Bulgaria are relying on Germany and Italy to protect them. Now it has to be seen what Hitler and Mussolini will do against Russia. If something happens Turkey and other powers will also pluck up courage.
Purani: What will happen to Hitler’s pact with Stalin?
Sri Aurobindo: “Pact of brotherhood sealed in blood.” That’s what he said. Hitler has cloven-hoofed everybody. Now it is his turn to be cloven-hoofed. Carol says the British and the Jews dislike Russia having taken this step. Molotov will laugh at the idea.
Purani: In the recent naval engagement it seems that the Italian fleet ran away from the British.
Sri Aurobindo: Italy may not want any engagement now unless the odds are in its favour. It might be waiting until the armistice and if the French fleet is removed it may start something.
Evening
Sri Aurobindo: There is no confirmation of Russia’s ultimatum to Hungary.
Purani: No, it may be just a rumour.
Sri Aurobindo: Yes, the news is too good to be true. (Laughter)
Purani: The communists in Bessarabia are very happy and the Romanians are fleeing. Trainloads seem to be crossing each other carrying refugees.
Sri Aurobindo: And the Jews are running away to the Russian territory. (Laughter)
Purani: The clashes, they say, are due to the overflow of the Russians.
Sri Aurobindo: Yes, they outpaced the scheduled time!
Purani: The clashes on the Hungarian frontier have stopped.
Sri Aurobindo: Italy and Germany have asked the Hungarians to suspend their claims for now.
Satyendra: De Gaulle wrote a book before the war which has been translated into German. It seems he foresaw modern warfare in the form of mass employment of tanks at selected points, as Hitler has done, as well as, mechanised units, armoured cars, surprise attacks in the Ardennes and on the Meuse and the defection of Belgium. He says, “This mechanical system of fire, shock, speed and camouflage will reveal itself when first let loose by bringing into action at least two thousand tanks.”
Sri Aurobindo: I see! That is prophetic! Where is that news?
Satyendra: In the Indian Express. (Laughter) But it quotes a French paper.
Sri Aurobindo: Of course, it can’t write that itself. It seems France invents these plans and Germany accepts them. It was the same as the plan of depth-defence in the last war. Some soldier invented it but the French refused to accept it. One of the copies of the plan was seized by the Germans and they put it into operation; it gave a lot of trouble to the British at the end of the war. The Siegfried Line is modelled on that system for about thirty miles!
Purani: Spain’s attitude seems to be doubtful. Hitler has massed an army on the Franco-Spanish frontier.
Sri Aurobindo: Why?
Purani: Perhaps he wants to take Gibraltar with Franco’s help.
Sri Aurobindo: Then it will be very difficult for the British to hold it. Gibraltar is only a rock and, besides, Spain has got Tangier on the other side.
Nirodbaran: They shouldn’t have allowed Spain to get that.
Sri Aurobindo: Then they shouldn’t have allowed Franco to win at all. If they had helped the Republican party, Franco would have been defeated. All this has been due to Chamberlain.
Purani: Lloyd George also asked for help to the Republicans at that time.
Nirodbaran: And they would have had Russia as their ally and she would have been more trustful of them. Now to take Gibraltar may well be Hitler’s next move.
Sri Aurobindo: Most probably.
Purani: Subhas Bose has been arrested.
Sri Aurobindo: Yes, by a friend of his. (Laughter)
Purani: It may be a prelude to the arrest of Congressmen. It seems there has been no change in the Government policy as a result of the Gandhi-Viceroy meeting. Repetition only.
Sri Aurobindo: Looks like that. Otherwise Rajagopalachari wouldn’t have said what he did in his speech. It must be due to these officials at Simla. They are all fossilised people. Once they have a fixed idea, they won’t give it up.
Satyendra: The I.C.S. mentality.
Sri Aurobindo: Yes. Englishmen in England are quite different. Many of them, even conservatives, are speaking of a change in India.
Satyendra: Though Amery seems to be a strong man, he doesn’t have any idea about the Indian situation and the official mind.
Sri Aurobindo: He knows what is going on behind the scene.