Nirodbaran
Talks with Sri Aurobindo
Volume 1
10 December 1938 – 14 January 1941
8 August 1940
Purani: The Viceroy has issued a declaration that the expansion of the Council can’t be delayed any more. India will have the right to frame her own constitution as soon as possible after the war.
Sri Aurobindo: Did he say that?
Purani: Yes, and he has invited Abul Kalam to see him.
Sri Aurobindo: But how is the constitution to be framed? What procedure?
Purani: He doesn’t say. It may not be a round table conference again.
Sri Aurobindo: Will the Indian leaders be able to come to an agreement? If the Congress stands for the Constituent Assembly, Jinnah won’t consent.
Satyendra: If the Viceroy has conceded our right to frame our own constitution, it is quite reasonable.
Sri Aurobindo: Yes, only people don’t listen to reason nowadays.
Satyendra: And it is a greater step than Dominion Status.
Sri Aurobindo: Certainly.
Satyendra: And the expansion of the Council, that is also quite reasonable.
Nirodbaran: But one must know what part they would play.
Sri Aurobindo: Quite so. But the Government can’t be expected to pass all authority to people who have no idea about war and no experience of it.
Purani: But what will be the procedure for the constitution?
Sri Aurobindo: It is better not to quarrel over that now. The Indians can decide that themselves afterwards and they ought to be able to do it if they can speak of a National Government.
Satyendra: On the whole it is a very good advance unless there is some catch. One must read the text first.
Sri Aurobindo: Quite so. It depends also on what powers they give to the Council. The Viceroy ought to have seen Rajagopalachari too. Perhaps he was not in Madras during the Viceroy’s stay.
Satyendra: Yes, Rajagopalachari is the leader now.
Sri Aurobindo: No, Gandhi is the leader. But he doesn’t want to lead and the others refuse to follow him. (Laughter)
Purani: Perhaps there may be a conference of Premiers in which Rajagopalachari will be present. Now only Punjab and Bengal are left to decide. Sind also to some extent.
Sri Aurobindo: Sind’s stand is very near to that of the Congress.
Purani: But the Princes may stand in the way. They ought to make a common cause.
Sri Aurobindo: How can they when the Congress has intimated that they have no right to exist and that in a free India they may have no place? If the Congress had kept its claims moderate, then by an inner pressure of circumstances they would have come round. You have read C.P. Ramaswamy’s speech the other day? It is a very telling speech. He says: You ask us to depend on you, but you have already spoken about our extinction in the future constitution of India. How can we acquiesce in that extinction?
By the way, the Viceroy has banned only drills with weapons and what they call para-military uniforms – any that may have a military-uniform semblance. Apart from that, organisations can exist.
Nirodbaran: Somebody said to Charu Dutt, “You speak of the dominating influence of Sri Aurobindo over the sadhaks. How is it then that idiots living under his influence produce only third-rate works?”
Sri Aurobindo: Has the “somebody” read Nishikanta’s poems? If he also calls them third-rate, he must be an idiot himself.
Nirodbaran: Dutt was speaking highly – as in fact all do, Dilip, etc. – of Jyoti’s book Sandhane (In Quest). According to Dutt she has taken a long stride from Rakta Golap (Red Rose), her last book.
Sri Aurobindo: I see!
Nirodbaran: Dutt says Rakta Golap is an imitation of Tagore’s poetic-prose novel Char Adhyaya (Four Chapters). Only the style is very good. That is true to some extent. She gave most of her attention to style and tried to make it poetic. And Sandhane she wrote long ago. Rakta Golap was the latest.
Sri Aurobindo was amused to hear that the latest book was inferior to the previous one.
Sri Aurobindo: What does the idiot say about it?
Nirodbaran: He may not have read it.
Sri Aurobindo: But can a novel be written in a poetic style?
Nirodbaran: Tagore’s is not a novel but a novelette, one may say.
Sri Aurobindo: One can write a romance in such a style.
Purani: Tagore is doing so many new things. They say he has written mystic poems about death after his recent serious illness – what death is like, one’s feelings about it and so on.
Sri Aurobindo: Anybody can write that out of imagination; one needn’t have any experience.
Nirodbaran: And everywhere he is talking of his approaching death.
Sri Aurobindo: He has been dying for the last twenty years. When he came here, he spoke of it.
Purani: Even his stories are not very good.
Nirodbaran: Not true. He is considered one of the best story-writers.
Purani: I mean like Chatterji.
Sri Aurobindo: Yes, but he is not a novelist.
Nirodbaran: No.
Purani: You have seen Patrika’s review of Nishikanta’s book? While Tagore has praised his chhanda and bhasha, people call it halting and Sanskritised.
Sri Aurobindo: Stupid review!
Evening
Satyendra said something about the Commonwealth. Sri Aurobindo then spoke about the recent declaration of the Viceroy.
Sri Aurobindo: The British have more of diplomacy but less of the right spirit. A great deal depends on the way things are put. This statement is most uninspiring and unconvincing. And there is a snag too. If the constitution is unacceptable to large and important sections, then the Government can’t agree to it. That means that if Jinnah and the Princes don’t accept it, there is no settlement.
Satyendra: Nehru says the Sevadal won’t be dissolved. They will keep their organisation.
Nirodbaran: With lathi1 ?
Satyendra: Why lathi? It is non-violent.
Sri Aurobindo: Or is the lathi for others to beat them with? (Laughter)
Purani: Yes, they can offer their lathi to the opponent and ask to be thrashed.
Satyendra: That would be ideal non-violence.
Sri Aurobindo: A hundred per cent!
Purani: Somaliland is now being attacked by the Italians.
Sri Aurobindo: I thought they had already taken it.
Nirodbaran: The British are retiring after inflicting heavy losses.
Sri Aurobindo: And without any loss to themselves! Bhaskar has again put an exclamation sign. (Laughter) They don’t seem to have any force there at all.
Purani: Only camel corps.
Sri Aurobindo: I don’t understand their war strategy. There is no head or tail to it.
Purani: They think if they win the war, they can take the place back.
Sri Aurobindo: Yes, but if Egypt loses, their chances of winning the war will be jeopardised. Egypt occupies an important position.
Nirodbaran: Shyama Prasad has given a one-month time-limit to the Bengal Government.
Sri Aurobindo: Inspired by Bose’s success? But there won’t be any Muslim to join him.
Nirodbaran: Tagore has been made an Oxford Doctor and got a Latin address.
Sri Aurobindo: And he replied in Sanskrit. Gwayer could have spoken in Irish.
1 A stick or staff used for defence.