August 21, 1971The Mother
Agenda
Volume 12
August 21, 1971
Do you have something to ask?
I am wondering a lot what would have power over the physical mind.
How do you mean?
For instance, you set the mantra going and it repeats itself for a certain time, and then whoosh! it goes off on a tangent and you get going on something else. I can't make it steady. Or else I have to re-start the movement mentally, by force. By applying the mind.
(after a silence)
I don't know, for me it comes spontaneously. At times it's very intense, very much in the forefront (depending very much on circumstances or the people present); at times it's... like something very vast – very vast – and very tranquil (Mother extends her arms in a great Rhythm). When that is there... circumstances aren't important, people aren't important, everything is... all is calmly divine. At times it becomes powerful and active: that depends on the people, on circumstances, or on something that is happening somewhere which I come to know later.
I don't know, I can't say.... The Divine seems to be closely “associated” with all, all, with the whole sense of the physical world, so much so that it seems the physical would have no foundation, no continuity if it weren't so. So I am unable to say.
Actually, I can't make out the state I am in. I simply feel in expectation of something.
(Mother nods vigorously) Ah, of that I am sure!
(silence)
Now I am having some activities at night, completely new as I have never had before, extremely concrete and in which living
people are mingled with those we call dead – and they are the SAME, they are the same
there.1 For example, last night there was a very long activity with many people, and among those people was Purani (I see him very often); Purani had a major role, and M. and... (what's his name?) D. – D. and M. were
quarreling!2 (laughter) And one thing after another.... And I was like one of them, wearing strange clothes.
I am discovering a world I didn't know, which is the world... I wonder if it's not the vital physical? There were dances, movements.... That is, to put it in ordinary words: I have dreams such as I have never had before; only it's not dreams, it's an activity. It's a world I was totally unaware of, and which is like this (Mother interlaces her fingers to show a sort of interpenetration of the physical and that world).
There are so many, so many things to learn.
Yes!
(silence)
Only those with a physical body have the kind of reactions – pleasure, displeasure – we have in physical life. The others no longer have it. That seems to disappear with the purely physical consciousness.
(silence)
More and more I get the feeling we know nothing. That's all. That there is an infinite variety of things, and we know nothing.
Personally, I often complain about my nights because, starting at two or three o'clock in the morning, I get the feeling I have a lot of activities which seem completely stupid to me, involving all sorts of things and people and....
That's right.
And it seems stupid to me, you know, devoid of any meaning, and tiring moreover. What is it? I haven't the faintest idea.
Perhaps it's that. Perhaps that same world.
But what's one doing there!
(silence)
For our physical consciousness it's stupid, of course.3
Yes, it looks stupid.
That's just what I had last night. And it was quite natural and... without reaction.4
I think it's the mind that gives meaning to things; without the mind, things ARE, without their being given a meaning – they are because they are. So then for us, for the consciousness as it has evolved here, it is perfectly idiotic. While there it seems perfectly natural.
That must be what makes people become “unhinged.” If they don't have inside what we could call the “divine support,” a kind of unshakable faith in the Truth and divine Grace, if they don't have that....
(Mother remains absorbed until the end)
It's a phase we have to go through. We have to... go through it.
1 Mother means that there is no difference between the “living” and the “dead.”
2 Purani died in December 1965; M. and D. are “living.”
3 But for someone on the other side, how would a man turning on a faucet and brushing his teeth look?
4 Pleasure, displeasure.